← The Peter Attia Drive

#74 – Jason Fried: Optimizing efficiency and work-life balance

Oct 7, 2019 2h 24m 27 insights
<p>In this episode, Jason Fried, co-founder of Basecamp, shares his beliefs around achieving business success in a modern world which tends to disproportionately focus on the massive success stories (the outliers). Jason gives his honest take on companies like WeWork, Uber, and Lyft that may give off the appearance of wild success but may instead provide an example of the dangers of perverse incentives. We get into Jason's backstory, and how his affinity for optimizing efficiency and production in the workplace culminated with the creation of Basecamp, his very successful web-based project management software business. Perhaps most importantly, we get really deep into all aspects of work-life balance and what it really means to "work hard" (Stay tuned for an AMA-style deep dive into the topic of work-life balance with Jason in the near future). In addition, Jason provides many more valuable nuggets including thoughts on some common mistakes made by businesses today, the value of giving employees autonomy, how to take the right types of risks, why he doesn't set any goals, and much, much more.</p> <p><span style="color: #333333;">We discuss:<br /> <br /></span></p> <ul> <li><span style="color: #333333;">Jason's background and his early entrepreneurial spirit [9:45];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">Views on completing higher education and the notion of hard work [24:00];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">Beliefs around success in business [35:00];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">WeWork, Uber, and Lyft: Poor business practices and the dangers of perverse incentives [41:30];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">Jason's early career: his redesign approach and personal motivation [56:00];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">The genesis of Basecamp [1:10:00];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">Why Jason does not set goals but instead focuses on a vision [1:12:15];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">Workplace motivation and hiring practice [1:20:30];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">The importance of luck and not overworking [1:32:00];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">A framework to work less and optimize for workplace autonomy [1:38:00];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">The importance of saying 'no' more often (and tips for doing so) [1:55:00];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">A shared passion for watches [2:03:30];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">Guarding against the perils of phone addiction [2:08:45];<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">Jason's views on email and chat for communication [2:15:00] and;<br /></span></li> <li><span style="color: #333333;">More.</span></li> </ul> <p>Learn more: <a href="https://peterattiamd.com/">https://peterattiamd.com/</a><br /> <br /> Show notes page for this episode:<a href="https://peterattiamd.com/jasonfried" rel="noopener" target="_blank">peterattiamd.com/jasonfried</a><br /> <br /> Subscribe to receive exclusive subscriber-only content: <a href="https://peterattiamd.com/subscribe/">https://peterattiamd.com/subscribe/</a><br /> <br /> Sign up to receive Peter's email newsletter: <a href="https://peterattiamd.com/newsletter/">https://peterattiamd.com/newsletter/</a><br /> <br /> Connect with Peter on <a href="http://Facebook.com/PeterAttiaMD"><u>Faceboo</u></a><u>k</u> | <a href="http://Twitter.com/PeterAttiaMD"><u>Twitter</u></a> | <a href="http://Instagram.com/PeterAttiaMD"><u>Instagram</u></a>.<br /></p>
Actionable Insights

1. Prioritize Contiguous Work Blocks

Structure your workday to create large, uninterrupted blocks of time for deep, creative work. This helps avoid fragmented time, which leads to busyness without productivity, often forcing late nights and weekend work.

2. Seek Intrinsic Work Motivation

Prioritize work that intrinsically motivates you and aligns with your personal beliefs and aesthetic preferences. Lacking this internal drive for core tasks can lead to misery and a sense of wasted time, making long-term engagement unsustainable.

3. Say ‘No’ for Future Flexibility

Be deliberate in declining future commitments, especially those far in advance, by considering if you’d genuinely want to do it at that future moment. Saying ’no’ to one thing preserves flexibility and opens up countless other unforeseen opportunities, whereas ‘yes’ often means saying ’no’ to many.

4. Avoid Addictive Social Media

Recognize the addictive nature of social media platforms, which are designed for engagement and manipulation. Actively limit or eliminate their use, and delete apps that create unhealthy feelings like vanity, sickness, or regret, to prevent them from controlling your emotions and behavior.

5. Prioritize Asynchronous Communication

Opt for asynchronous, long-form communication methods, such as well-written documents or summaries, over real-time chat or rapid-fire emails. This allows for complete thoughts, reduces pressure for immediate responses, and respects others’ schedules, leading to clearer communication and less frantic work.

6. Question Workload Expectations

Regularly evaluate your tasks and processes to identify and eliminate work that is unnecessary or doesn’t contribute significantly to the core objective. Much of the perceived workload is often wasted effort, and editing it down can free up significant time and energy.

7. Focus on Project ‘Epicenter’

Identify the absolute core, or ’epicenter,’ of any project or product, and prioritize executing that essential component exceptionally well. This allows you to deliver core value efficiently, avoid feature creep, and work more effectively by distinguishing needs from nice-to-haves.

8. Avoid Busyness Addiction

Actively avoid the addiction of ‘busyness’ by focusing on completing tasks within contiguous blocks of time rather than constantly switching between many things. This reduces the feeling of being manic and allows for more focused, calmer, and ultimately more effective work.

9. Practice Making Money (Profitability)

Prioritize profitability from the outset in your business, viewing it as a fundamental skill that requires practice. Relying on external funding without generating your own ‘fuel’ (profit) creates undue pressure and a disadvantage.

10. Take Risks, Don’t Risk Everything

Embrace calculated risks where the downside is manageable and won’t jeopardize your core operations or livelihood. This allows for experimentation and innovation without the existential threat of an ‘all-in’ gamble.

11. Work in Small, Autonomous Teams

If leading a team, structure work into small, autonomous projects (e.g., maximum six weeks) handled by small teams (e.g., maximum three people). This minimizes dependencies, reduces complexity, and allows for quicker completion and deployment of features.

12. Set Time-Bound Project Appetites

Instead of making open-ended estimates, define a fixed ‘appetite’ (e.g., six weeks) for a project, and scope the work to fit within that time. This prevents projects from dragging on indefinitely, reduces demoralization, and allows for a ‘circuit breaker’ if the project isn’t working out.

13. Embrace Trade-offs and Concessions

Actively discuss and make conscious trade-offs in project scope and quality to achieve efficiency and deliver core value. Not every component needs to be ’the best possible version,’ and strategically cutting features or complexity can save significant time without sacrificing overall value.

14. Don’t Emulate Large Companies

If you’re starting a new business, avoid trying to emulate the strategies and structures of large, established companies. Their scale and context are entirely different, and their methods are likely irrelevant or detrimental to a small, nascent venture.

15. Beware of Survivorship Bias

When looking at successful individuals or companies, recognize that they are often exceptions, and don’t solely focus on their patterns without considering the many who failed following similar paths. This helps avoid drawing misleading conclusions and making decisions based on incomplete data.

16. Build What You Personally Need

Create products or services that solve a problem you personally experience or need. If you need it, others likely do too, and this personal connection can drive motivation and ensure quality.

17. Be Honest When Declining

When declining an offer or invitation, be direct and honest about your reasons, without embellishment. Transparency is generally well-received and avoids misunderstandings or resentment.

18. View ‘No’ as ‘Yes’ to Other

Reframe your ’no’ responses not as rejections, but as affirmations of other priorities, options, or desired experiences. This mental shift helps overcome the fear of missing out (FOMO) and reinforces the value of your chosen path.

19. Eliminate Phone Notifications

Turn off almost all notifications on your phone, only keeping those that are essential for immediate needs. This helps you seek information when curious, rather than being constantly pulled by prompts.

20. Be Wary of Email/Chat Overload

Recognize that email and especially real-time chat tools can be toxic to productivity and mental well-being due to constant interruptions and the expectation of immediate response. They allow others to constantly add to your to-do list and fragment your attention.

21. Influence Change with Small Wins

If you want to change how your organization works, start by applying new methods to small, less critical projects to demonstrate their effectiveness. Building a track record of small wins can gradually influence others and build momentum for broader change.

22. Ride Your Success, Don’t Chase

If you achieve significant success with a venture, focus on sustaining and evolving that success rather than abandoning it to pursue new, potentially less likely, ventures. The chances of replicating a true ‘hit’ are very slim, and continuous innovation within an existing success can be more rewarding.

23. Avoid Unnecessary Growth Pressure

Resist the urge to grow too fast or raise excessive outside capital, as these often lead to unnecessary pressure and self-destructive business practices. Maintaining control and avoiding external growth mandates allows for a more sustainable and less stressful business trajectory.

24. Don’t Be Afraid to Start Small

When starting a business, keep costs extremely low and focus on the core exchange of value, even if it’s just for fun initially. This minimizes risk and allows for organic growth without undue financial pressure.

25. Understand Business Gets Harder

Understand that business complexity and challenges generally increase over time, rather than decrease. This helps manage expectations and avoid the trap of overworking in the short-term with the false promise of an easier future.

26. Avoid Ad-Driven Content

Seek out content creators who use a subscriber model rather than ad-driven models. This helps ensure the information shared is unbiased and driven by genuine belief, fostering a simpler and more honest relationship.

27. Support Valued Content Directly

If you learn from and find value in content, consider supporting the creators directly through a subscription. This helps fund their work and can provide access to exclusive benefits, ensuring the content remains high quality and ad-free.